Rivian’s chief software officer, Wassym Bensaid, joined Nilay Patel in the latest Decoder interview. And his comments on CarPlay show Rivian continuing to double down on its refusal to support Apple’s platform.

Nilay Patel’s Decoder podcast often features high-profile guests in the automotive world, and Patel always asks about CarPlay. Last fall, for example, Rivian’s CEO RJ Scaringe joined the show and said that “customers will appreciate” the lack of CarPlay eventually.

Decoder’s latest episode features Rivian’s software chief, Wassym Bensaid. It arrives shortly after Rivian launched its highly anticipated AI assistant.

In addition to talking about the assistant, and Patel’s positive and negative experiences with it, the conversation highlights CarPlay.

Bensaid explains that the whole debate over excluding CarPlay is made “completely obsolete” by the rise of AI. Here’s the full quote:

What we’re seeing right now with the advancement of AI technologies is just another reason why I deeply believe that RJ and Rivian made the right choice by investing into our own technology and software. Cars are moving from, as you said, the buzzword “software-defined” to “AI-defined.” The possibilities now for such deep AI integration in the car make the entire CarPlay debate completely obsolete.

He goes on to say that “agentic integration” will entirely upend the way users interact with apps.

For what it’s worth, Bensaid does tout internal surveys to support Rivian’s approach to building its own software systems. He said that five years ago, CarPlay was the top request from Rivian customers. After shipping the R1T and R1S, “more than 70 percent of customers were requesting CarPlay.”

However, in a recent survey “that number is less than 25 percent.” That’s a big shift, though I do wonder if the data shows any change from prospective customers, not people who already drive a Rivian.

You can read or listen to the full interview here on The Verge.

Do you think CarPlay’s importance is changing at all with the rise of AI tools? Let us know in the comments.

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