Professional surfer and scientist Cliff Kapono gets his best ideas when he’s in the ocean. “The thinking turns off, but the ideas start to pour in,” he says. To him, the connection makes complete sense because the native Hawaiian word for “idea” is the same as “wave” — nalu.

Kapono is a native Hawaiian; these are the Indigenous people of Hawaii. He grew up in Hilo, Hawaii, where he is based today, blending his lifelong passions for surfing and science daily. “I want to understand how waves move across our planet, so I can be better at catching these waves,” he says.

As a kid, all he wanted to do was surf every day, all day long. He practiced until he could surf at a professional level. “That’s the same thing that I did in science. It started off where I just wanted to take science classes and get A’s. With surfing, the equivalent is catching nice waves,” Kapono says.

Kapono is now a professional free surfer. These athletes chase the best swells around the world to earn sponsorships and media exposure. He also has time to do scientific research. For Arizona State University’s Center for Global Discovery and Conservation Science in Hilo, he studies how humans and ocean environments interact, from molecular to macro scales, through the lens of a surfer. In this interview, he shares his experience and advice with Science News Explores. (This interview has been edited for content and readability.)

When I was younger, I didn’t think I could put the two together. But if I were to pursue a full-time career in either, I would be unhappy. So I figured out a path where I could spend just as much time inside the science lab as I am in the ocean. The Western world defines your job based upon what you get paid to do, not about what you invest your time into. I totally departed from that idea. My job is to be the best version of me. The best version of me is surfing good waves every day and understanding about the natural world through a scientific lens. 

The clearest example of a productive society is the amount of leisure time they have. If you have a highly functioning system, you have surplus time. Our society was able to invest that time into the cultural arts, such as surfing.

Surfing has been documented within our histories for close to 2,000 years. It’s not just recreation. Surfing is so deeply embedded into the Hawaiian culture. It’s in the stories, the chants and the songs. It was celebrated tremendously by all peoples — from folks who were fisher people, farmers, basket weavers, cooks, to the royalty. In the late 1800s, it began being sort of exported outside of Hawaii and demonstrated at different locations around the world. By the 1950s, it reached global fame. 

A success for me is elevating scientific literacy within the surf community. As a scientist, I represent an identity in the surf community that I didn’t see growing up. I can play that role for the next surfer scientist — or maybe it’s a surfer chef or surfer lawyer — to show that you can still contribute on a professional level to multiple communities within society at the same time.

I’m currently trying to identify the structural complexity of reefs at some of the best, most iconic waves around the world. It’s known as bathymetry, the study of the seafloor. I’m looking specifically at where certain famous waves break. Over the last five years, I’ve been traveling around mapping the characteristics of these different reefs. I’m seeing similarities between these waves based upon their reef structure. A personal interest and curiosity is now supported by research — that keeps me excited. Finding out that, by learning more about the reef, I can be a better surfer is a breakthrough for me. 

I have gotten a lot of F’s in my academic career, but I’ve never felt like getting an F was a failure. My dad would always tell me that failure is an event, not a person. It’s just a moment that passes, so it’s not going to stay with you very long. So, I’ve actually embraced a lot of failures. I failed at many science experiments. I failed at catching a wave. I fail to ride the wave all the way to the shore. Sometimes I fail to even stand up. I fail in obtaining resources to do my science. I fail in knowing what the right answer is. I fail daily. But failing is not a bad thing if it helps you to find the successes. I don’t feel embarrassed or ashamed to fail anymore. I just tell myself that it’s all going to work out in the end if I don’t let the failure stop me.

I always looked up to elders in the Hawaiian community that maybe aren’t super famous but, within our communities, really treated me kindly and shared knowledge with me. Whether they were teachers, family members or professional surfers, I always looked up to people who were willing to share what knowledge they had with me. Anybody who helped me to navigate the difficulties of being on an island in a small community and feeling like there’s a bigger world out there. Anybody who helped me to get to a higher level of thinking and develop my intelligence, from my academic intelligence to my emotional intelligence. The people who helped me understand more about the world and myself.

I volunteer for a scientific group called Mega Lab that is trying to develop technology to protect the ocean and give it to communities who need it the most. The biggest project we have going on right now is mapping a million reefs by 2030. We’re teaching 10,000 citizen scientists how to map the reef with their GoPro, cell phone or camera. The program is called Map to Adapt. Anyone can join the Mega Lab — artists, skaters, ballerinas or firefighters. There are no requirements, you just come by and start doing science together. We just want to have a good time and party for the planet.

Having an interest in science really has helped me to be a better surfer. And my interest in surfing has helped me to become a better scientist. Science is like a superpower for me. It’s really fun to be able to jump from a community that is so focused on riding a wave into one that wonders about how that wave moves. To me, that’s a pretty epic way to live.

abstract: Something that exists as an idea or thought but not concrete or tangible (touchable) in the real world. Beauty, love and memory are abstractions; cars, trees and water are concrete and tangible. (in publishing) A short summary of a scientific paper, a poster or a scientist’s talk. Abstracts are useful to determine whether delving into the details of the whole scientific paper will yield the information you seek.

academic: Relating to school, classes or things taught by teachers in formal institutes of learning (such as a college).

ancestor: A predecessor. It could be a family forebear, such as a parent, grandparent or great-great-great grandparent. Or it could be a species, genus, family or other order of organisms from which some later one evolved. For instance, ancient dinosaurs are the ancestors of today's birds. (antonym: descendant)

bathymetry: A term for the mapping and study of a seafloor or a lake bed. It focuses on the structure of that underwater landscape — its varying curves, projections and other shapes.

cell: (in telecommunications) A technology that relies on a large number of base stations to relay signals. Each base station covers only a small area, which is known as a cell. Phones that rely on this system are typically referred to as cell phones.

citizen scientists: Public volunteers — people of all ages and abilities — who participate in research. The data that these citizen “scientists” collect helps to advance research. Letting the public participate means that science can get data from many more people and places than would be available if they were being collected by trained scientists alone.

component: Something that is part of something else (such as pieces that go on an electronic circuit board or ingredients that go into a cookie recipe).

conservation: (v. conserve) The act of preserving or protecting something. The focus of this work can range from art objects to endangered species and other aspects of the natural environment.

coral: Marine animals that often produce a hard and stony exoskeleton and tend to live on reefs (the exoskeletons of dead ancestor corals).

culture: (n. in social science) The sum total of typical behaviors and social practices of a related group of people (such as a tribe or nation). Their culture includes their beliefs, values and the symbols that they accept and/or use. Culture is passed on from generation to generation through learning. Scientists once thought culture to be exclusive to humans. Now they recognize some other animals show signs of culture as well, including dolphins and primates.

develop: To emerge or to make come into being, either naturally or through human intervention, such as by manufacturing.

environment: The sum of all of the things that exist around some organism or the process and the condition those things create. Environment may refer to the weather and ecosystem in which some animal lives, or, perhaps, the temperature and humidity (or even the placement of things in the vicinity of an item of interest).

field: An area of study, as in: Her field of research is biology. Also a term to describe a real-world environment in which some research is conducted, such as at sea, in a forest, on a mountaintop or on a city street. It is the opposite of an artificial setting, such as a research laboratory. 

Hawaii: This central Pacific island chain became the 50th U.S. state on Aug. 21, 1959. Moving from west to east, its eight major islands are Niihau, Kauai, Oahu, Molokai, Lanai, Kahoolawe, Maui, and Hawaii (also known as the Big Island). The entire crescent-shaped island chain spans some 2,400 kilometers (1,500 miles). Each of the state’s islands was created from one or more volcanoes that long ago sprang up from the ocean floor. The chain sits some 3,857 kilometers (2,397 miles) west of San Francisco, Calif., and 8,516 kilometers east of Manila, the Philippines.

intelligence: The ability to collect and apply knowledge and skills.

lens: (in social issues) An attitude or perspective that helps bring broad issues into focus.

macro: (antonym: micro) An adjective that means on a big or broad scale. (in computing) Computer code to execute a single instruction, which in turn directs the computer to use some preset instructions to perform a particular, desired task.

media: A term for the ways information is delivered and shared within a society. It encompasses not only the traditional media — newspapers, magazines, radio and television — but also digital outlets, such as Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, TikTok and WhatsApp. The newer, digital media are sometimes referred to as social media. The singular form of this term is medium.

model: A simulation of a real-world event (usually using a computer) that has been developed to predict one or more likely outcomes. Or an individual that is meant to display how something would work in or look on others.

native: Associated with a particular location; native plants and animals have been found in a particular location since recorded history began. These species also tend to have developed within a region, occurring there naturally (not because they were planted or moved there by people). Most are particularly well adapted to their environment.

navigate: To find one’s way through a landscape using visual cues, sensory information (like scents), magnetic information (like an internal compass) or other techniques.

planet: A large celestial object that orbits a star but unlike a star does not generate any visible light.

reef: A ridge of rock, coral or sand. It rises up from the seafloor and may come to just above or just under the water’s surface.

role model: Someone whose skill, behavior and/or personality makes them an inspirational ideal, the type who inspires others to model themselves after this person.

society: An integrated group of people or animals that generally cooperate and support one another for the greater good of them all.

system: A network of parts that together work to achieve some function. For instance, the blood, vessels and heart are primary components of the human body's circulatory system. Similarly, trains, platforms, tracks, roadway signals and overpasses are among the potential components of a nation's railway system. System can even be applied to the processes or ideas that are part of some method or ordered set of procedures for getting a task done.

technology: The application of scientific knowledge for practical purposes, or the devices, processes and systems that result from those efforts.

void: An empty space or cavity.

wave: A disturbance or variation that travels through space and matter in a regular, oscillating fashion.

Western: (n. the West)  An adjective describing nations in Western Europe and North America (from Mexico northward). These nations tend to be fairly industrialized and to share generally similar lifestyles; levels of economic development (incomes); and attitudes toward work, education, social issues and government.